Interview
with Doug Petrie
Date: 2/29/00
Quick - what do Spider-Man, VH1, Clarissa Explains it All and Harriet the Spy have to do with Buffy the Vampire Slayer?
Alright, not much... unless you`re Buffy Executive Story Editor Doug Petrie, that is.
A native of New York, Petrie started on his path to Buffy`s door as a typical kid weaned on comic books and science fiction, but surprisingly, no scary movies.
"I was kind of a wimp on the scary movies," Petrie says. "When I was young, my parents [not Dick Van Dyke and Mary Tyler Moore, by the way] used to torture us - well, I thought it was torture, they were just driving somewhere - by driving by the drive-in theater and I would catch a glimpse of the Planet of the Apes films. I would freak out at the idea of apes walking around and talking - it would just scare the hell out of me. I hated scary movies, but I always loved superheroes. I can`t remember a time when I didn`t love Batman and Superman, and later on Spider-Man."
Growing Up Petrie
The the DC heroes may have been idyllic role models and icons for young Petrie, Marvel heroes were ultimately cooler, filled with heroes who had real world concerns such as getting a date, finding money for bills and keeping their identity a secret from prying Aunts and schoolmates.
"I guess I`ve always been drawn to a really emotional, realistic take on superheroes," Petrie says. "That`s what was so wonderful about the Marvel Comics - they were so realistic. Peter Parker could never get a date, they took place in New York City, and the characters seemed to have real-life problems. I stayed away from DC Comics, which were at that time were more for kids, and didn`t treat there own premises very seriously, whereas the Marvel bullpen of writers seemed to use `what if this stuff was really happening?` as their main tenet to write on. They were telling much more satisfying stories as a result. The influence and impact Marvel comics had on me as an adolescent was just incalculable."
Petrie`s office is a shrine to his self-confessed stilted adolescence - movie posters ranging from The Matrix to Forbidden Planet, Goldfinger, Indiana Jones, Star Trek, Star Wars and Shaft line his walls, along with a poster for the first film that scared him silly - Jaws ("I was traumatized by it at first, and then after the trauma wore off, I was obsessed by it and started drawing sharks incessantly").
"All the larger-than-life, good guys versus bad guys stuff of the `70s had a huge impact on me," Petrie says. "all of this ends up in Buffy in some form or another."
In college at William and Mary, Petrie studied theater, and was a founding member of the Cornerstone Theater Company in New York after graduation. While there, he wrote, produced and acted in plays. As a way of paying his bills, Petrie wrote for VH1`s Entertainment Watch with Katherine Kinley. "I got to be insanely good at writing `Hi, I`m Katherine Kinley and this is Entertainment Watch, blah blah blah...,`" Petrie says. "The really sad part of it is that we actually got our news by going down into the lobby of the building we worked in and buying three newspapers to see what was in the news"
Moving on from VH1, Petrie`s next step on his road to Buffy was that of a writer for the Nickelodeon promotions department. Much like a sitcom Einstein in his own patent office, Petrie kept busy in the off hours by writing spec scripts for anyone who would read them, eventually landing a job as a writer on the Nickelodeon Melissa Joan Hart series, Clarissa Explains it All. (Okay, so the Einstein reference was thin).
Go West, Young Man
Petrie moved to L.A., where his Nickelodeon experience got him the job of writing Harriet the Spy, and then…..nothing. "I lived in development hell," Petrie says. "You thought it was just a place where scripts end up? Nope - writers are there too. We`re the guys with pitchforks poking the other people."
While in hell, Petrie wrote spec scripts for both The X-Files and The Simpsons, a move he doesn`t advise wannabe television writers to follow. "Every agent on the planet told me that they were useless together, and that I had to use one or the other, not both," Petrie says. "No one was going to read both of them and give me a job."
So what happened?
"Joss Whedon read both of them and gave me a job. Buffy`s a unique show, so the fact that I had action-packed sci-fi adventure combined with very verbal, goofy comedy was perfect for him. Joss liked my X-Files take, we spoke and we hit it off."
`Hit if off` is Petrie-ese for bonded once the two realized that they were both huge comic book fans. "One of the first things I mentioned to Joss after I came onto the show - just after the third episode had gone on the air - I told him I really liked the episode entitled "Witch," and we spoke about one shot in particular where Buffy rises up into the frame," Petrie says. "Her line was `I feel much better now,` and then you cut to a wall, hear a punch and see the woman Buffy punched go flying into the wall.
"I told Joss that it reminded me of Ben Grimm, the Thing punching someone, and that he edited it the way that Marvel Comics were put together, and he understood what I was talking about and I understood what he was talking about, and to this day, we annoy people by veering off into comic book talk and no one knows what the hell we`re talking about. We`ll just go on and on about it if no one stops us."
Getting his Feet Wet
| Petrie
worked for the show during the second season, and
was asked to join the Buffy staff a year later by
Whedon. Since then, Petrie has written and
overseen the major arc storylines of Buffy,
helping to push the mayor`s ascension last year,
turn Faith from a fun roguish Slayer into a
psycho villain, and developing Riley and the
Initiative this year. "In total, we`ve got five writers on the series, counting Joss," Petrie says. "They`re a great group of people to be working with, and everyone has their own strengths that we play up. One episode that would be a good example of what I do - I wrote Episode 7, `The Initiative.` We knew we were going to be starting a big, seasonal storyline about who these secret agents are that we saw in the very first episode of the season. We knew all along where we were going with that, and we teased the audience with that for a while, and then with Episode 7, it was time to let the cat out of the bag, basically. |
 |
"All
we knew for sure, and it all came from Joss, was that
somewhere in the episode, it would be revealed that Riley
was a secret agent, and we knew we wanted to do a big
reveal where he was talking to his buddy about girls, and
they walk through a retinal scan, and they`re still just
talking about girls. They go down an elevator, still
talking about girls, and they come out in a giant James
Bond complex, and they`re still talking about girls.
"There`s nothing in pop culture that we won`t steal,
and that was our True Lies moment. We wanted to do the
moment where Schwarzenegger and Tom Arnold were talking
about their family lives, and they walk into a giant
secret agent complex. From there, we had to figure out
where the soap opera was at that point in the season, and
where Buffy was as well in terms of her emotional life
and development, which is really the heart of the show.
We never do an episode where we don`t say, `Where is
Buffy, emotionally?` That`s always the big question.
Sometimes we`ll come up with episodes that have great
stuff in them, but they don`t answer the question of
where Buffy is emotionally, and we`ll throw them out. If
it doesn`t answer that question, it`s not a Buffy
episode."
Essentially, the season`s map is locked up in Whedon`s
head, he spills it to his writers on the show, and
together, they come up with the signposts for the season,
mixing arc stories with stand-alones, such as the
upcoming "Superstar," written by Jane Espinson.
Timewise, Petrie says writers have two to three weeks to
write an episode at the beginning of the season -
something which shrinks to mere days near the middle of
the season. "The standard time is about a week and
half to two weeks," Petrie says. "But it can
get much worse. There was one episode that was written by
three people over a weekend. It`s just a relentless pace.
The deeper you get into the season, the less time you
have."
Season 4
Ask Petrie what he likes about the current season of
Buffy, and he`ll almost certainly turn into a fanboy on
you, going on about how happy he is with the Initiative`s
presence in this season`s storyline - even though he
knows some viewers aren`t too thrilled by James Bond
Juniors invading Sunnydale.
"Some people like the secret agent stuff more than
others - it`s a big turn for this series, an X-Files-y
turn," Petrie says. "But our fans are honest.
We`ve heard from both sides. I think people still miss
Angel and the dynamic that the series had when he was
around, but that`s one of the difficulties of a
television show - if you want it to be good and resonate
with real life, you have to move things forward.
Sometimes the fans come with you, and sometimes they
don`t."
 |
"The
secret agent stuff if cool, but what I`m really
happy about at the moment is the return of Faith
who comes back for a two-parter starting this
coming week. I got to write the three Faith
episodes last season, and I just love the
character. It`s great to bring her back." Judging from the fan reaction that both Faith`s return and other turns in the storyline have generated, Buffy`s fans have again proven their loyalty to the series, something which amazes and inspired Petrie. |
"I
think it`s great that we have such passion among our
fans," Petrie says. "When I was growing up, TV
shows like Star Trek and The Prisoner were just huge to
me. They weren`t so much shows you would watch as they
were places you would visit, and they seemed very
real."
"Something that science fiction in general, and TV
science fiction can do really well is create a world. If
people want to visit that world and are interested in
that world and want to keep it going through fan fiction
and want to explore that world, great. I couldn`t
possibly be happier about that, because I was like that
myself. I was a huge fan of comic books and science
fiction myself and still am, so more power to them for
keeping the discussion and interest alive."
Love - Buffy Style
Something that`s drawn attention both from fans and the
mainstream media, ever eager for the hint of a
"controversial topic" to plaster on headlines
is Willow`s relationship with Tara. While Whedon has
already admitted that the relationship will be romantic
in nature, Petrie stresses that the storyline is a
natural expansion of Willow`s character rather than an
attempt at a ratings boost by injecting a controversial
topic that viewers will find objectionable (like those
who would have problems with a Willow-Tara relationship
are watching a series with witches, vampires and demons,
anyway...)
"Everything we`ve done comes from what we think of
is best for the character," Petrie says. "We`ve
never really done anything to get attention. With the
Willow stuff, we`d actually like less attention. What I
think Joss was naively hoping for was that it would just
go without a big brouhaha, but Entertainment Weekly
picked up on it immediately.
"We`ve seen other TV shows where they promote a
woman kissing a woman and put it in their commercials
like that`s the biggest things going on in the series -
`Tune in and watch two chicks make out!` We want to do
the opposite. We don`t want to draw attention to it. It`s
just a part of the show, and it`s not that she`s choosing
a lifestyle, it`s that Willow is beginning to love Tara.
Having seen the actress and the scenes with them in it,
it seems perfectly natural. It doesn`t seem like that big
of a deal to us, but we`ll see what the public response
is. We`re trying not to get attention, and we may have
been a little naive about that, unfortunately."
Speaking of the series romantic relationships, Petrie has
his own take on why, in the words of South Park`s Mr.
Mackey, "Sex is bad, mmmkay" on Buffy. Face it
- Buffy & Angel; Willow & Oz; Willow &
Xander; Faith & Xander - anytime the characters sleep
with one another on Buffy, bad things happen.
"We really try to stay away from the horror movie
staple of two kids having sex and then, usually the woman
being killed in some horrible way," Petrie says.
"Our basic approach isn`t so much that sex is bad,
but that high school and early college romance is fraught
with peril. The odds of having your heart broken in high
school and college are very close to 100 per cent, and
everyone goes through heartbreak. It`s more dramatic to
go through heartbreak than to have a perfect
relationship."
It all comes down to drama, Petrie says, and heartbreak
and characters pining for one another makes for good
drama, while happy couples don`t. Although that maxim
will be tested with Willow and Tara.
"Willow and Tara are going to have a good, happy,
satisfying relationship," Petrie says. "That`s
something that we`re more acutely aware of and we
definitely don`t want to touch on `being a lesbian is
bad.` We`ve all seen shows where if you have any kind of
gay tendencies, you must be killed or made to suffer for
no other reason other than you`re gay. We`re hyper aware
of that, so we`re more predisposed to have things work
out for Willow and Tara. In fact, if Tara were a guy, I
would predict a near 100 per cent chance of a breakup for
Willow. The fact that Tara is not a guy may make things
work out better, because we can avoid what we feel is
this old cliché."
Xander, Faith and the End of the Season.
While fans may be happy with Willow`s development and
growth as a character this season, Xanderites have had it
rough. Granted, how much growth you can accomplish while
you live in your mother`s basement? Still, Xander
definitely seems to have been relegated to the back
burner since Buffy went off to college. It`s all
according to plan, Petrie reveals.
"We`re very aware of what`s going on, or not going
on with Xander," Petrie says. "We`re loading
the gun for him and letting him spin his wheels for a
little while longer. The best thing I can say is stay
tuned. He won`t stay that way forever. We`re having fun
with him right now, because for one, its fun to humiliate
Xander, and two, we`re taking him to another place. There
are a couple of options for that - one is the most likely
candidate, and then there are some others that are even
more radical that I don`t think will happen. We`ve got
plans for him."
| Speaking of plans, Petrie let a few out regarding the return of everyone`s favorite rogue slayer, Faith, as well as what`s coming for the end of this season. "The return of Faith is a two-part story in episodes 15 and 16, which start this week," Petrie says. "I wrote the first of the two, and Joss wrote and directed the second. We`re going to see the ramifications of Faith`s actions once she comes out of her coma, before she heads over to Angel for a little while." |  |
"After
that, things with the Initiative will start to wrap up,
and by the end of the season, we`ll have a conclusion of
sorts to that storyline. Then we`ll be doing a little
something unusual this year. The season will end with the
final two episodes and we`ll have a `coda` episode
afterwards. Rest assured, we will be ending the season -
there won`t be a cliffhanger. We`ll end the storyline,
and then have an entire episode that will be an emotional
dénouement to the season. The climax will have already
happened, and this will look at where everyone is after
that. It should be pretty unique for a television series.
Joss will be writing and directing the final episode of
the season."
While Petrie wouldn`t divulge any details on the season
finale on pain of death in many nasty forms by Whedon, he
did guarantee that Buffy wouldn`t, as with seasons past,
run away for the summer.
Slayer Futures
Okay, so Buffy`s a 19 year-old freshman, and, given the
real-time approach of the series, she`ll be in her early
20s within a couple of years. However, it`s a pretty well
established fact in Slayer lore that Slayers don`t live
past 25. Is, ulp, death really in the future for the
Buffster? Petrie remains annoyingly vague.
"We don`t know," Petrie says. "Death will
always be looming. Would we kill Buffy? I don`t think so.
Will she always be really close to death? Yeah - its part
of her job. But as we`ve all seen in the series, the
thing about Joss is that you never know. Also, in the
reality of network television, it would be insane to kill
Buffy. When you`ve got an actress like Sarah Michelle
Gellar, we wouldn`t replace her - she is Buffy. She is
the show."
"Also, talking about if from a character standpoint,
her possible death is definitely something we`re aware
of. Part of what makes the show fun is that for a light
pop culture romp, death is a big part of it. We really
want to go there as much as possible, so it will always
be around. It`s a fact of life for a Slayer."
While he was loathe to nail down specifics, Petrie also
admitted that killing off Buffy, even if the television
series ended would close a door that the production
company is hoping to keep open. "I personally would
be very surprised and if we killed her because then we
couldn`t move on to the big dream which may or may not
happen - the idea of doing a $65 million motion picture
version that takes place in life after Sunnydale,"
Petrie says. "Would we like to keep Buffy around for
that? Um...YEAH! We`d all love to do a bigass movie
version of Buffy. Will she always be confronted by death?
Yes. Will we kill her before we could make a movie? No
way."
Finally, if you ask Petrie to single out a moment he`s
most proud of during his tenure on Buffy, he`ll give it
some thought, mention the episodes starring Faith, but
ultimately, his proudest achievement is a little closer
to his heart.
"I`m just proud to be here and contribute to the
show," Petrie says. "I can`t really point out a
single moment that I can say I`m proudest of. I`m proud
to be on this staff and proud to be part of this
enterprise. I`m not a big team player, coming from movie
world, but this is the one time in my life where I can
say that I`m really proud to be a part of this
team."
